Don't take me too seriously. I'm just saying that plenty of guys got plenty big without drinking some sort of supplement powder before and after a workout. The supplement industry is selling billions a year. And, it just keeps growing. Take a look at the advertising. Did the dudes hyping the product get as big as they are from the product or hard work in the gym, eating like crazy and Juice and they really didn't need the product. My own personal opinion is that you really don't need all that supplement crap. Now I'm all for protein powder supplementation, but that's it for me.

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I'm a hard knock flier and a rainbow rider, a straight shootin' son of a gun...

DISCLAIMER: I reserve the right to be wrong on every statement I make....

You're right on all accounts my friend except for them all being crap though.That seem's to be where we differ.In my honest opinion,the true problem lies in guys going starting a supplement thinking they will turn them into the Hulk even if they are not genetically designed to be,nor is their diet and training what it should be.Supplements can do exactly as their name implies "SUPPLEMENT" the rest of the things ive mentioned.Sadly too many hop on a supp for a week or 2,don't get the results they wrongly expected and then scream "FAKE"

Also,the only way I judge if anything works FOR ME,is like I always say,TRIAL AND ERROR.I do as much research as I can on anything BEFORE I decide to try it or not and then properly take it and honestly monitor my results closely and only after a long time taking it.Especially so with supps as they are not meds,they do take time to have an effect.They are only helping your own body produce results.Not a drug that has immediate reactions.

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FREEDOM IS SOMETHING TAKEN

Where have I said all supplements are crap? I said that in my opinion you don't need all that crap. Don't take literally what was meant colloquially. So all medications have an immediate effect and supplements don't? I'm just going to leave that silliness alone. Perhaps you should read up on physiology and chemical reactivity.

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I'm a hard knock flier and a rainbow rider, a straight shootin' son of a gun...

DISCLAIMER: I reserve the right to be wrong on every statement I make....

Brother I wasn't insulting you in any way.I said we agree.If I misread what you said,I apologize.Didn;t know you were so sensitive.You want a hug?? LOL

As for your remarks about drugs and supps having the same time duration on reactions being silliness,that's not worth a response because THAT is silliness and ignorance.

Now as for "READING" up on things,once again,you keep reading and i'll keep doing firsthand research by real life trial and error.When I do think of trying a new substance,I will absolutely read up on it but as I continue to say only after trying things for myself will I say what does or doesn't work for me.Not from what some lab nerd tells me.

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FREEDOM IS SOMETHING TAKEN

If I misinterpreted what you wrote, my apologies. LOL I'll settle for a hug. Let me try to briefly explain where I was coming from regarding reading your statement that supplements take time to work where a drug has an immediate reaction. Take caffeine for example. Caffeine is a drug but also sold as a supplement. Banned by the International Olympic Committee as a performance enhancing drug. Caffeines effects start within 30 minutes of ingestion. Caffeine is found in numerous pre-workout energy supplements. Doesn't take time to have an effect the response is fairly quick. That's just one example.

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I'm a hard knock flier and a rainbow rider, a straight shootin' son of a gun...

DISCLAIMER: I reserve the right to be wrong on every statement I make....