If this is ok with everyone I spoke to a retired ifbb pro buddy and said if we would like he could come on and list his cycles from before his pro card and through his pro yrs he said he doesn't mind even giving his name as long as there are no questions asked about other pro's or specific contests. If it's something that u guys would like lmk. He was a well known pro just never made it past 10th in the o but still can shed light on what guys or at least he took. He did stop due to health issues but would love to shed light on the topic.